There's a disparity right now between the match-going Tottenham fans and some on social media when it comes to Ange Postecoglou.
Spurs are by nature an impatient club despite a lack of actual destination and that often spreads to the fanbase, yet the Australian is getting far more backing for his major rebuild from the supporters than his recent predecessors did, despite the club's current league position being worse than when those managers lost their jobs before him.
The supporters sang Postecoglou's name at various points throughout Sunday's defeat to Liverpool and that's likely because the 59-year-old has such a clear vision for their club - a rarity at Spurs - and a positive style of play and there's an understanding of the fires he is fighting all around him right now with the number of unavailable players - the worst he has faced in 26 years of coaching.
As silverware-laden as Conte and Mourinho were, there was no other connection for the Spurs supporters to hang on to them when the two managers brought in to focus solely on the result, regardless of how they got it, did not actually get those results. With Nuno Espirito Santo, who will face his old club on Boxing Day, there was nothing to latch on to at all beyond the early 1-0 wins, or anything to suggest that he could turn around a club that has long sat in the doldrums.
The football was turgid and mind-numbing under all three when it didn't bring three points, and goals were so hard to come by. Under Postecoglou you can at least see what Spurs are meant to become when all the pieces are finally available.
Even with a less experienced squad than those before him and of course no Harry Kane nor a settled and experienced defence, there are glimpses of what his Tottenham Hotspur can be through the fog of injuries and they certainly do not struggle for goals.
They need defensive reinforcements to tighten up at the other end and most importantly, unlike his predecessors, Postecoglou has the full backing of his players, who more than anyone know the physical toll the current stacked physio's room is taking on their squad.
There was always a fear that this match might be one step too far in a week in which Spurs had won back-to-back games, including progressing to the Carabao Cup semi-finals with a draining tussle against Manchester United.
"It was a difficult day for us and a painful result. Credit to Liverpool, they are a very good side and are in a great moment," Postecoglou told football.london after the game. "They are very settled, in great form, great belief. It was just a bridge too far for us today. You could tell we were lacking a little bit of energy and the ability to really compete with them at the same level."
There's no getting away from the fact that conceding six goals at home is dreadful. However, it's worth looking at who Postecoglou had to ask to step out to face the best side around.
On Sunday, Spurs' tired makeshift defence to take on a Liverpool team packed with experience contained an 18-year-old midfielder, a right-back playing at left-back in only his second Premier League start, a 22-year-old with only 12 Premier League starts to his name, an overused, overloaded right-back running on empty and a goalkeeper behind them playing his fifth Premier League game in 18 months.
Tottenham aren't getting any leeway for that and a defence that patched up was inevitably pulled all over the place by a fresh Liverpool side, who had enjoyed an extra day's recovery and were much-changed anyway from their Carabao Cup win at Southampton.
The home fans did get to see at the other end of the pitch a Spurs side lacking attacking options but yet still a better Brennan Johnson shot away from scoring four goals against by far the best team in Europe right now.
Tottenham are the Premier League's top scorers, but while this was the first time they have lost a game by more than one goal this season, the results have not matched their attacking ability and that's what needs to be fixed as players slowly return to fitness.
Postecoglou was asked in his press conference after the game about the Tottenham fans singing his name even before his team's spirited attempt at a comeback. The Australian always seems awkward when asked such questions but he gave a little credit to those who have backed him and took aim at those who don't.
"The fans, I've often said, should feel they need to about what's happening. I thought they were good today, very good, given it was a difficult day for sure. But they still got support of the players which was important," he said.
"Who knows, maybe some of them understand the situation we're in right now. It seems many don't. In the context of what we're trying to do, where we're at, I hope they see what we're trying to build here because I really believe it's going to be something that gives the club and fans what they want."
It's unclear who any Tottenham fans that want Postecoglou out would demand instead. There are some fairly uninspiring alternatives out there and, to be honest, it would take Mr Miyagi and his magic healing hands to make any real difference that Postecoglou cannot.
For even if Arne Slot swapped dugouts on Sunday he would still have had only the same 13/14 tired players to use every single game every three days for the past month or so.
The ire among the game-going fanbase is mostly aimed at chairman Daniel Levy rather than Postecoglou as the constant in the club's struggles to push on on the pitch over the past two decades-and-a-half. There was a protest before the game by a number of vocal supporters opposite the club shop and the releasing of some balloons in the 24th minute which went a little more unnoticed.
The increasingly popular Kulusevski/Levy chant was heard throughout the game from the south stand and looks set to stick around. A rare interview with the Spurs chairman, conducted by the former Palace supremo Simon Jordan, is set to be released in the near future and it will be interesting to see how much within it shows the room is being read - something not often associated with Tottenham.
For instance, on Sunday, amid a fan protest bemoaning Spurs being run as a business first and football club second, people sat around the stadium dressed as guards from the Netflix show Squid Games, the result of a no doubt financially beneficial link-up between the streamer and the Premier League club.
It and the Squid Games-inspired pre-match montage were about as thrilling for the club's beleaguered fans as the huge announcement last month that Spurs had released a new font.
Postecoglou may well have turned around and saw some of the Squid Games guards in the west stand behind the dugout and wondered if any of them could play at centre-back.
To be fair to the right-hand side of his defence, they came out of the game with some credit. Djed Spence made it three starts in a row and did well on the whole, with only Trent Alexander-Arnold completing more defensive actions than him on the pitch. The makeshift left-back won four of his five tackles, made eight ball recoveries, three blocks, three clearances, three headed clearances and one interception. He also won seven of his 10 ground duels and and made two successful dribbles.
Both he and Archie Gray showed the composure on the ball that those around them often lacked. Spence also managed a 93% pass success rate with 54 of his 58 passes finding their target and 18-year-old Gray had 90% with 66 of his 73 passes reaching the correct destination.
There were a couple of inexperienced moments for both but on the whole they were the brighter lights on a tough day for the defence. Postecoglou have Gray in particular one big round of applause for a breaking run out of defence and up the pitch in order to force the play in a positive direction.
This was one of those afternoons when Radu Dragusin looked just 22. He allowed Luis Diaz to drift in behind him in the first half and then just before the break got nowhere near winning a header that allowed Dominik Szoboszlai to get up the pitch before scoring what proved to be a key goal in ensuring the destination of the game.
Pedro Porro looked leggy again and has played far more minutes than any other player in the team with 1,888 to his name. Dejan Kulusevski (1,784) and Dominic Solanke (1,747) are next on the list.
Looking at Spence now the question will continue to be why he didn't get more Premier League minutes when Porro needed a rest, unless there was something Postecoglou saw on the training pitches that those outside couldn't.
Porro is being targeted frequently by oppositions with cross-field balls over his head and he's often left defending one-vs-two when Kulusevski gets stuck upfield and the right-sided midfielder isn't there to cover.
Likewise when Porro himself gets caught upfield, as he did when Kulusevski failed to pass to him when unmarked, then Spurs have a real problem. Mohamed Salah profited from that exact situation with Liverpool's fourth goal.
Fraser Forster has lost some of his confidence gained in recent weeks after those two gaffes against Manchester United in midweek and his first pass of Sunday under pressure went straight to Salah. Thankfully for him the Egyptian shot into the side-netting.
The veteran keeper was also slow in a couple of situations, with Alexis Mac Allister reacting faster to head over him for Liverpool's second goal and then slow off his line as Szoboszlai ran at him before the break for the third.
After Thursday night's proud press conference following the win against United, Postecoglou was more annoyed by the media's insistence in ignoring the major injury issues in Spurs' backline in particular.
It started in his radio and TV interviews and when a BBC interviewer asked whether the amount of goals conceded at home was down to the injuries or whether it was more than that, Postecoglou rubbed his face, smiled, shook his head and said: "You know what I'm just going to stop answering these questions. If people can't see the obvious, I'm not going to point it out.
"So make what you will of it. Yes, we're conceding goals, but if you want to discount the fact that we're missing a goalkeeper, two centre-backs (technically three) and a left-back as well and that has coincided with what we're doing then I don't know what to say anymore.
"I think people make up their minds in their own way. They either think what I'm doing is good or they don't think what I'm doing is good and that's fine."
When the reporter said they weren't discounting the injuries and that anyone would miss those players, the Australian shot back: "Well you are, you are when you're kind of suggesting 'is there anything more than that?'. Well it's fairly significant.
"If you took out Liverpool's goalkeeper, two centre-backs and a left-back, even Liverpool, but any other team apart from Liverpool, I think they might find it tough-going as well."
A question then in his press conference, asking whether sticking to his style will benefit him and his squad in the long-term, was taken with a hand to his head and frustration.
"I think I have been really patient the last 18 months sitting up here answering the same questions over and over again," he said. "If people want me to change my approach, it’s not going to change.
"We are doing it for a reason, we are doing it because we think it will help us to be successful. If people don’t understand the circumstances we are in at the moment, the challenges we have from a squad perspective which are as obvious as you want to make them.
"I get the idea that people think that I should just flip a switch and change and somehow that will miraculously make us a better team. It is what it is. I’m just going to continue, stay focused on trying to build this team to be the team we want. In the interim we are going to have to accept there are going to be challenges along the way."
He seemed to bite his tongue with a frustrated, almost manic grin when asked with the next question whether Liverpool showed him the yardstick he needed his Spurs team to reach.
"Fair bit. Fair bit. Considering they...no I'll just leave it at that. They are a good side. A top side," he said before stopping his answer abruptly.
James Maddison, who scored for Spurs with a first half curling effort, admitted that the volume of games was proving difficult for the threadbare squad.
"It’s been like that for weeks. It is a busy room the physio room at the minute with senior players, big experienced players in there and on nights like tonight against top opposition, that is invaluable really, the seniority of players and with experience of big games like this," he said.
"But credit to our young lads who are stepping up and lads who haven't played. I don't want to sound like I am making excuses either but Djed only started his first Premier League game last week, Archie is 18 and we bought him from the Championship. Radu didn't play a lot of football last year in the Premier League and Fraser has obviously had to come in with Vic out.
"There are a lot of lads I am proud of who keep going out because we’re rolling out the same sort of team every game at the minute because we play every three days and the squad is quite depleted with injuries. We’ll keep going and stick together. I can only feel for the fans but I want them to know that it hurts us as well. Results like that don't just hurt supporters, they hurt the club as a whole."
Beyond the backline there were more mixed performances. Yves Bissouma had the joint-most ball recoveries on the pitch with nine but won only half of his ground duels and his inconsistent passing led to one wild ball allowing Salah a shot at goal.
The return of Rodrigo Bentancur for the match at Forest will bring crucial fresh legs into Tottenham's engine room and allow some rotation.
Maddison and Sarr were both mixed in their contributions, with good moments and poor ones, and the same could be said for the front line.
Son struggled to make much of an impact with hesitant play and decision-making and Postecoglou's recent comments comparing Salah and the Tottenham captain didn't serve him well during this game.
Salah was everywhere with two goals and two assists, while Son only mustered one shot at goal and managed just four touches in the Liverpool box. Kulusevski for context had 12.
The Swede looked tired but kept pushing at the visitors and grabbed a deserved goal in the second half, volleying home from Dominic Solanke's clever chipped pass over the Liverpool defence. It meant Kulusevski has scored in five consecutive matches and now has seven goals and seven assists, meaning 14 goal involvements in 26 games.
"I think Deki's been outstanding all year," said Postecoglou about the Swede adding goals to his performances. "That's probably the next part of his game, not that he's never had it but he's adding it now. He's been really clean with his finishing and it's a credit to him. He's taken his game to another level. I think a few of the boys have to be fair. It's probably not as evident at the moment because we're in a difficult situation."
Solanke not only grabbed that clever assist but also finished well from Brennan Johnson's headed assist in losing Virgil van Dijk with a turn and shot on the slide. That means four goals and two assists in December for the £65million striker and 10 goals and five assists so far this season. That's a decent return of 15 goal involvements in 23 games for the 27-year-old.
Spurs did not give up and had Johnson connected with a loose ball in the Liverpool box with more power, rather than Allison saving it low down the scoreline would have been closer if not still ridiculous.
"[Giving up] is not our way, that is not Ange’s way," said Maddison. "It is not his methods to sit back at any point and I am proud of the lads who kept going. It can be very easy to sit back and not let any more chances or keep a scoreline to a minimum, especially when they get the fifth.
"To be fair to the lads, they kept going, we scored another couple and we’ll keep going and dig in. We had a great night, a brilliant night, here on Thursday and a really difficult one tonight. The good and the bad, you’ve got to stick together."
Postecoglou added to that: "We are still growing as a team and we are 18 months into building a new team with a new way of playing. It’s fair to say we have had some challenges along the way considering the availability [of players]. Particularly at the moment so it is very hard to see where we are at [compared to Liverpool].
"What I will say is the players are not wavering in their commitment to what we are trying to do. Even today, a difficult day, I’m really proud of the fact they still tried to play a certain way knowing that is our way forward."
Postecoglou must continue to try to push through the next two fixtures, away at Nottingham Forest and then at home against Wolves before his team can enjoy the rarest of things - six days between matches.
"We've been [playing with this small group of players] for the last three weeks. Pretty much after the City game we had a look at it and we knew this would be our toughest period for sure," said the Spurs boss.
"We've had shorter turnarounds than just about every opponent we've played so far, shorter rest days than every team we've played whether it's here or in Europe, and I haven't been able to rotate the team, rest players or rotate players.
"I have massive admiration for the efforts these players are putting in for this club at the moment. We know what a difficult situation it is and that's not going to change in the short-term. We've just got to push on."
Tottenham need reinforcements as soon as January arrives, both from internally and externally. Bentancur and Destiny Udogie are expected to be back to face Forest with Ben Davies, Richarlison and Mikey Moore not too far behind them.
That at least will give Postecoglou options in his team selections and an ability to manage within games.
When asked if reinforcements are required from January 1, he said: "Yeah, absolutely. Some of them will be internal. We're at different stages of getting players back from injury. We've got a couple of long term ones in Vicario and Wilson, but the rest hopefully at some point in January they'll come back.
"That will help us in terms of just getting numbers back and dealing with the schedule, because the schedule is not going to change. We're in the Carabao Cup semi-final, we're still in Europe and the FA Cup starts. We're still in all the competitions, so it's not going to get any easier. We're going to need some of those players hopefully to come back and contribute."
On the prospect of January signings, he added: "Yeah, I guess if the right players are there. Again it's about making sure it's something that's going to help us continue to build on what we’re doing."
It's all too easy to judge the Postecoglou way while he's using a makeshift team that is battered, bruised and tired, when that will not showcase the real version of what the Australian wants on the pitch.
The calls for a compromised version of his football will continue when the results do not come, but the Spurs boss is right in saying you either fully commit to a rebuild and a new way of playing or you don't. The middle ground is what kills it.
Telling the players that when the going gets tough, you can just sit back, hunker down and hope - which Spurs have been utterly dreadful at anyway in recent years - will only cause them to revert to the mixed messages whenever difficult situations arise rather than being brave and playing through.
The north London club's fans have often got frustrated over the seasons when their team has naturally retreated further and further back into its shell, invited pressure and eventually collapsed under the weight it.
They finally have a manager who will not allow that to happen, but some now want that old way back at times. It doesn't work as a muddled mess. Yes, Spurs suffered a heavy defeat on Sunday but it's the first time they have lost by more than a single goal all season. There's an old expression that you don't don't throw the baby out with the bathwater.
Tottenham haven't committed to a complete sea change for years and it's why they haven't really known what they are on or off the pitch in decades. They've suffered from an identity crisis so who can blame anyone outside the club for not knowing who they are either.
Rebuilds are painful, particularly when almost half of the players are missing, and Postecoglou and his players must get their head down and dive through this final week before they can break water and finally take a breath as the reinforcements start to appear on the horizon.
Time and patience are required but can anyone in and around Tottenham muster it this time? If they can, the outcome might just finally be different this time.
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